ord from geylang , can come back sg ?

[siamcutey]

Originally Posted by sherm

Hi, SC.

After reading so much of the post, I now know is difficult to bring your WL back to Sg.

As for my case, Im not too sure whether is different from the rest. therefore i need some of your advise.

My WL ORDed just 2 months ago. B4 she able to leave, she had to report to Anti Vice. This is what she describe me during the interview.
She was being ask how she got this forge passport, and her reply was don't know. The anti vice still insist to ask her to tell the true and even ask her how much she can get this. She did the same reply by saying dun know. Then soon anti vice told her she can come back to Singapore but she need a Singaporean to declare for her (How to declare I yet to know). She also didnt sign any form that she is unable to enter SG for next few yrs. This is wat I'm puzzled about. The Anti Vice know her forge passport but yet allow her to enter Sg.

So any comments. Thanks

This WL was "forced ORDed" because of passport issues is it? That means to say AV sent her back before she finish her tour of duty in SG?

If that AV officer told her she can come back to SG and need a Singaporean to declare for her, get her to use her real passport and bring her identity card as well. Then u get her to write your name, address, phone number in the column of her visiting friends. In case anything happens, at least ICA know who to contact. If ICA ask her questions, just tell her to answer truthfully. When ICA ask questions, actually they are not interested in your answers. Everyday got thousands walk past their counters. They only want to find out whether you are lying. Because once you tell a lie, they just charge you with an offence.

And must remember ICA or AV told her can come SG? Both ICA and AV are diff depts. AV say so, doesn't mean ICA say so. AV say can come but ICA is the one she will go through when coming SG.

I believe co-operation in such matters will make the trip smoother.

SC

[sherm]

Originally Posted by siamcutey

This WL was "forced ORDed" because of passport issues is it? That means to say AV sent her back before she finish her tour of duty in SG?

If that AV officer told her she can come back to SG and need a Singaporean to declare for her, get her to use her real passport and bring her identity card as well. Then u get her to write your name, address, phone number in the column of her visiting friends. In case anything happens, at least ICA know who to contact. If ICA ask her questions, just tell her to answer truthfully. When ICA ask questions, actually they are not interested in your answers. Everyday got thousands walk past their counters. They only want to find out whether you are lying. Because once you tell a lie, they just charge you with an offence.

And must remember ICA or AV told her can come SG? Both ICA and AV are diff depts. AV say so, doesn't mean ICA say so. AV say can come but ICA is the one she will go through when coming SG.

I believe co-operation in such matters will make the trip smoother.

SC

Thanks SC.

You are right... it was the AV who forced her out of job becos of passport issue.

As you mention writing my name and phone number.. is it on the declaration form when they were issued during the flight?

Confirm it was the AV that told her she allow to come to SG. So what can I do to make sure that the information was pass down to the ICA?

Thanks for your help.

[siamcutey]

Originally Posted by sherm

Thanks SC.

You are right... it was the AV who forced her out of job becos of passport issue.

As you mention writing my name and phone number.. is it on the declaration form when they were issued during the flight?

Confirm it was the AV that told her she allow to come to SG. So what can I do to make sure that the information was pass down to the ICA?

Thanks for your help.

U can tell her to give it a try since AV says she can come back. On the white card, she just fill in accordingly.

The part where it says has she come in to SG under another name and passport, she has to tick 'yes'. The immigration officer will ask her about this upon seeing the 'tick'. Just tell her to relate to the immigration officer the truth what AV told her. Then u tell her to write ur name, contact no on a separate pc of paper clip to the passport.

Because in such cases, either it works or it don't work at all. Because she came in SG to work on fake documents. But the chances are good in the sense that self declaration is made and no intentions to withheld any information.
ICA is run by humans and as humans, they still have a certain form of compassion in them.
If your girl is out to cheat them, she would not have declared everything too.

SC

[sherm]

Originally Posted by siamcutey

U can tell her to give it a try since AV says she can come back. On the white card, she just fill in accordingly.

The part where it says has she come in to SG under another name and passport, she has to tick 'yes'. The immigration officer will ask her about this upon seeing the 'tick'. Just tell her to relate to the immigration officer the truth what AV told her. Then u tell her to write ur name, contact no on a separate pc of paper clip to the passport.

Because in such cases, either it works or it don't work at all. Because she came in SG to work on fake documents. But the chances are good in the sense that self declaration is made and no intentions to withheld any information.
ICA is run by humans and as humans, they still have a certain form of compassion in them.
If your girl is out to cheat them, she would not have declared everything too.

SC

Thanks for your advise.

In fact.. during the interview with the Anti Vice.. she didn't sign any documents.

can she still work in singapore? I mean not as WL.. normal job

Once again Thanks. You've been a great help.

[siamcutey]

Originally Posted by sherm

Thanks for your advise.

In fact.. during the interview with the Anti Vice.. she didn't sign any documents.

can she still work in singapore? I mean not as WL.. normal job

Once again Thanks. You've been a great help.

During her departure she did not sign anything, but during her arrival, what did she signed?

BTW, dun think she can hold another work permit in SG, regardless of whether its a decent normal job or WL.

SC

[sherm]

Originally Posted by siamcutey

During her departure she did not sign anything, but during her arrival, what did she signed?

BTW, dun think she can hold another work permit in SG, regardless of whether its a decent normal job or WL.

SC

She only did sign a document claiming that she can't married to Singaporean. That's all. Erm.. I also think it will be difficult for her to find a job here. But I told her to give a try.

Anyway she soon will be coming and I told her the way as u told me. What if the officer ask her how and why she change her name?

Thanks SC

[siamcutey]

Originally Posted by sherm

She only did sign a document claiming that she can't married to Singaporean. That's all. Erm.. I also think it will be difficult for her to find a job here. But I told her to give a try.

Anyway she soon will be coming and I told her the way as u told me. What if the officer ask her how and why she change her name?

Thanks SC

To get a job in SG, she either need to have a work permit or be a PR, which I think is very very very very very hard.

If your girl already declared to officer she change her name , why would the officer ask her?

SC

[ansonlky]

Originally Posted by siamcutey

Some people say 3 yrs unofficial ban, some say 1 yr, some say 2 yrs, best is next time anyone's tirak going to ORD, teach them to ask the AV officer, if want to come back to singapore for holiday, how long should they stay away from SG.

- The passport which she used to come SG 3 times and the changing of her name must not be declared or else she can be charged.
If she wants, she can change her name and then use the new name to apply for a social visit pass. But u must declare that she has come to SG to work as Cat40 if asked. In many cases, the girls were caught because they fake identification documents.

I still believe honesty in self declaration is the best solution. Because by not doing this, think of everytime pass by immigration, how scary if kenna. Machiam like carrying drugs.

First of all, u must understand all the proper channels to go through. U should first go through ICA first. And if they always reject your applications, then go to your MP.
As for MP whether helps or not, I don't know. But also must see who is your MP. If your MP is Chiam ST or Low TK, seriously I don't see a good chance.

SC

SC bro thanks a lot for your priceless advice u are realli our saviour. but my question is when she had gone back 2 years ago, she decided to change her name to forget the past with no intent to make a new passport under a new name to sneak in she was also quite unclear about the interview she was called to repatritation department at ICA,she told me she was make to sign a declaration not to marry a singaporean and if she was to visit singapore she need to write in to request.so after a few months she went back, i ask her to come over and it happens that she was very lucky she managed to came in 3 times undetected.my point now is u told me not to declare this fact if i was ever to raise this appeal or issue to ICA or MP.but would they be able to trace her entry and records to singapore before even if i was to lie and ask her not to declare?lastly i am afraid that even if they approve her request to vist here when she cross the custom they might change their mind and nap her for past offence in sneaking in for the previous 3 times.and i am considering to register in bkk first and carry some supporting document to present to the authorities.whatever it is i still feel its very case to case basis and there is no standard guideline to this problem.some ppl managed to settle down some juz get thrown to jail.its a sad sight.worst comes to worst i'll juz have to settle down elsewhere wif her,no need to go for reservist or vote for the fucking government here.its gonna be a long road to happiness.life sucks.thaNKS FOR YOUR SUPPORT SIAMCUTEY...

[Rof|maoxz]

Originally Posted by siamcutey

First of all, u must understand all the proper channels to go through. U should first go through ICA first. And if they always reject your applications, then go to your MP.

As for MP whether helps or not, I don't know. But also must see who is your MP. If your MP is Chiam ST or Low TK, seriously I don't see a good chance.

SC

To discussed on bro ansonlky's case, regardless of which MP [Either Crown Prince, Old Lee or Mr Chiam] It doesn't necessarily add weight to tha appeal, ICA have the final say. Anyway, violating immigration act chapter 133, Section 8 (3) of prohibited immigrants is a no joke matter. The chances of return are remote.

[suteerak1099]

Originally Posted by siamcutey

KNN, Don't anyhow advise people. then what about those girls that get caught at immigrations and thrown to jail? They got the word Cat40 or WL on their face is it? If not how they get caught? It's random.

Yeah, some immigration officers don't ask. The word here is 'some'. If kenna that one officer who ask, hiong gan liao.

U can say here immigration don't do 100%, but if the 1% happens on his girl and his girl kenna thrown to jail, you want to eat black bean rice on her behalf is it.

ANd please don't talk cock that money talks. If money talks, can tell me how much to allow immigration offenders to get PR.

SC

SC, dont rebut for the sake of rebuting! immigrations/customs officers not being 100% is literally implying that its random. those of which that try coming in with fake documents, when discovered will naturally be apprehended & dealt accordingly, same thing applies for overstayers.

its quite idiot-proof to understand the simple logic that, immigration offenders already disqualify themselves for PR application. those refused entry from any country too, are denied the chance for social visits for some cases.

there's also too many red tapes to deter ex-yellowcard holders to even try for PR here - though some managed to do so (method unknown)

those who offer to be guarantor, are succeptible to deposits retained and/or additional fine, imprisonment, or both, when implicated. your senseless rebutal to me is; talking cock.

[siamcutey]

Originally Posted by suteerak1099

SC, dont rebut for the sake of rebuting! immigrations/customs officers not being 100% is literally implying that its random. those of which that try coming in with fake documents, when discovered will naturally be apprehended & dealt accordingly, same thing applies for overstayers.

its quite idiot-proof to understand the simple logic that, immigration offenders already disqualify themselves for PR application. those refused entry from any country too, are denied the chance for social visits for some cases.

there's also too many red tapes to deter ex-yellowcard holders to even try for PR here - though some managed to do so (method unknown)

those who offer to be guarantor, are succeptible to deposits retained and/or additional fine, imprisonment, or both, when implicated. your senseless rebutal to me is; talking cock.

So did you read carefully what he wrote initially?

He wrote that his girl wants to come SG on real documents but previously her documents that were used for Cat40 work was faked.

So if now she come SG and say her passport is real, and thus it will prove her prev passport is fake lah. Then u still dare to tell people to come in like dat and hiong.

Talk is cheap, u talk here no need any responsibility but the person who listens to what you advised might get arrested and jailed.

SC

[ansonlky]

Originally Posted by siamcutey

So did you read carefully what he wrote initially?

He wrote that his girl wants to come SG on real documents but previously her documents that were used for Cat40 work was faked.

So if now she come SG and say her passport is real, and thus it will prove her prev passport is fake lah. Then u still dare to tell people to come in like dat and hiong.

Talk is cheap, u talk here no need any responsibility but the person who listens to what you advised might get arrested and jailed.

SC

i think u 2 meant well, whatever it is we will never be in their shoes. Bro SC meant well and interpret it in a more realistic way as in what happens if the ger is caught. i have seen cases really damn bizzare and the ger can go undected many times but there are incidents its really one off affair,imagine my gf's friend can go thru undetected by air customs at changi several times but of all places why will she get arrested after her shopping trip wif her bf at woodlands custom. it all boils down to the ICA ppl if they *song* they let u go if not they will send them to jail.we cant change ppl mindset. singaporeans tends to be more against thai woman than other nationality this is something we got to admit.rules are mend to be broken or amended so its all up to the higher deciding body whether to be flexible and more lenient on them so that ppl like us will really get what we wan in life.its human to err.who would want to sell their body unless force by circumstances its the past look forward no pt brooding over it,never give up......

[siamcutey]

Originally Posted by ansonlky

i think u 2 meant well, whatever it is we will never be in their shoes. Bro SC meant well and interpret it in a more realistic way as in what happens if the ger is caught. i have seen cases really damn bizzare and the ger can go undected many times but there are incidents its really one off affair,imagine my gf's friend can go thru undetected by air customs at changi several times but of all places why will she get arrested after her shopping trip wif her bf at woodlands custom. it all boils down to the ICA ppl if they *song* they let u go if not they will send them to jail.we cant change ppl mindset. singaporeans tends to be more against thai woman than other nationality this is something we got to admit.rules are mend to be broken or amended so its all up to the higher deciding body whether to be flexible and more lenient on them so that ppl like us will really get what we wan in life.its human to err.who would want to sell their body unless force by circumstances its the past look forward no pt brooding over it,never give up......

Example:

Girl's Real Name is Ms ABC

Come to Sg and work Cat40 uses fake name Ms XYZ
When she left Sg, the ICA n AV depts have only her records as Ms XYZ and also her thumbprints.

On and off she come back SG and uses another passport with the name Ms JKL. If ICA don't check her thumbprints, they will never know she has come to SG and work as Cat40. But if they discovered that she is, they would realised that she is using another passport to come to SG. In their records with her thumbprints, its stated that she is Ms XYZ. So the same person is having 2 different passports and 2 identities.

If lets say Ms ABC decides to use her real name and real passport to come to SG, same thing will happen. AV and ICA only have her records as Ms XYZ but her thumbprints never change. So if unluckily she gets checked by ICA for thumbprints, ICA don't care the current passport is real or not. Because the girl never declare. False declaration at immigrations is a SERIOUS OFFENCE.

So if Ms ABC comes to SG with her real passport named Ms ABC, why should she tell the ICA that she has come to SG the past 3 times using another passport named as Ms JKL showing that she has came in undetected?

To keep it simply, ICA officers are also human like u and me. They have rules to follow, but their rules are very tough on people who make false declarations.

If declare at SG immigrations and they don't allow her entry, at most they tell her to take the next flight home, but to lie, cheat or try to con them, its digging own grave.

*Or the best solution will be the boyfriend go to Thailand first and come back to Singapore with her. So in case there is any part that needs communication, there is a presence of all parties and the boyfriend can help her to explain and make declarations. Upon self-declaration, If ICA asked why she changed her name, can just say that after going back changed the name for luck purposes or whatever reasons can think of. But the reason of self-declaration is to tell ICA, that both you and the girl have no intention to cheat/lie or do any funny stuff in Singapore.

Here, we are only talking about coming back to SG on social visit. Not on the topic of Permanent Residency.

Rules are black and white. But the rules are not so steadfast in the sense that there is still some areas left for compassionate reasons if one does not try to snake their way through.


SC

[ansonlky]

Originally Posted by siamcutey

Example:

Girl's Real Name is Ms ABC

Come to Sg and work Cat40 uses fake name Ms XYZ
When she left Sg, the ICA n AV depts have only her records as Ms XYZ and also her thumbprints.

On and off she come back SG and uses another passport with the name Ms JKL. If ICA don't check her thumbprints, they will never know she has come to SG and work as Cat40. But if they discovered that she is, they would realised that she is using another passport to come to SG. In their records with her thumbprints, its stated that she is Ms XYZ. So the same person is having 2 different passports and 2 identities.

If lets say Ms ABC decides to use her real name and real passport to come to SG, same thing will happen. AV and ICA only have her records as Ms XYZ but her thumbprints never change. So if unluckily she gets checked by ICA for thumbprints, ICA don't care the current passport is real or not. Because the girl never declare. False declaration at immigrations is a SERIOUS OFFENCE.

So if Ms ABC comes to SG with her real passport named Ms ABC, why should she tell the ICA that she has come to SG the past 3 times using another passport named as Ms JKL showing that she has came in undetected?

To keep it simply, ICA officers are also human like u and me. They have rules to follow, but their rules are very tough on people who make false declarations.

If declare at SG immigrations and they don't allow her entry, at most they tell her to take the next flight home, but to lie, cheat or try to con them, its digging own grave.

*Or the best solution will be the boyfriend go to Thailand first and come back to Singapore with her. So in case there is any part that needs communication, there is a presence of all parties and the boyfriend can help her to explain and make declarations. Upon self-declaration, If ICA asked why she changed her name, can just say that after going back changed the name for luck purposes or whatever reasons can think of. But the reason of self-declaration is to tell ICA, that both you and the girl have no intention to cheat/lie or do any funny stuff in Singapore.

Here, we are only talking about coming back to SG on social visit. Not on the topic of Permanent Residency.

Rules are black and white. But the rules are not so steadfast in the sense that there is still some areas left for compassionate reasons if one does not try to snake their way through.


SC

thanks bro for elaborating for me the scenario, my case was pretty clear cut. when she came to work here about 3 years ago, she used her real name in her original passport as she din go thru any agent or under any other house control,happens that at one of the routine raids she was rounded up by anti vice. before she was to be deported back the officers ask her a funny question on whether she wanted to carry on working here if so she would be send to those whorehouse on *contractual basis* and under *police care*. her terms was supposed to be 2 years but she left prematurely.after she went back her home town she changed her name and make a new passport coz during the morning she was to be repariated back she had to go ica to sign various documents and again mould her prints to the system.from what she tell me the officials told her strictly not to marry singaporeans and she was not allow to come in for undisclosed period for whatever reason she got to write in for permission to visit here.they also impounded her passport and chop all her pages so she cant use the original one.so after 6 mths she came to visit me under a new name and new passport but her ic number is still the same.my question is now how did she managed to get in since she was blacklisted and on the declaration form she never state honestly she was carring a diff name. so my dilemma now is while i am going to appeal and apply for her status.i dun know if i should be honest to tell the ica she had indeed came 3 times b4 in spite of the ban(am i making a mockery out of their system,seems to have loopholes) or should i just act blur and let them dig out themselves and in events if i am so fortunate to get the approval i am afraid they will backdate and charge her in future for false declaration for previous visits....

[siamcutey]

Originally Posted by ansonlky

thanks bro for elaborating for me the scenario, my case was pretty clear cut. when she came to work here about 3 years ago, she used her real name in her original passport as she din go thru any agent or under any other house control,happens that at one of the routine raids she was rounded up by anti vice. before she was to be deported back the officers ask her a funny question on whether she wanted to carry on working here if so she would be send to those whorehouse on *contractual basis* and under *police care*. her terms was supposed to be 2 years but she left prematurely.after she went back her home town she changed her name and make a new passport coz during the morning she was to be repariated back she had to go ica to sign various documents and again mould her prints to the system.from what she tell me the officials told her strictly not to marry singaporeans and she was not allow to come in for undisclosed period for whatever reason she got to write in for permission to visit here.they also impounded her passport and chop all her pages so she cant use the original one.so after 6 mths she came to visit me under a new name and new passport but her ic number is still the same.my question is now how did she managed to get in since she was blacklisted and on the declaration form she never state honestly she was carring a diff name. so my dilemma now is while i am going to appeal and apply for her status.i dun know if i should be honest to tell the ica she had indeed came 3 times b4 in spite of the ban(am i making a mockery out of their system,seems to have loopholes) or should i just act blur and let them dig out themselves and in events if i am so fortunate to get the approval i am afraid they will backdate and charge her in future for false declaration for previous visits....

So u are saying she was an FL, got caught, and then became Cat40 for a short while before going back.

The reason you are asking now is because you are also afraid that one day if her luck runs out, she will be caught for false declaration.

So now, you have to ask your girl whether is her name changed officially. If her name is changed officially, get her old name, new name and her IC no, go down ICA building and asked an officer regarding this issue. Try to say that you want to do everything the legal way. Just tell the officer you only want her to come Sg on Social visit pass. Relate the incident to the Officer and try to be a bit more pitiful and sincere.

Remember to get the Officer's name and contact no too. (At least if your girl next time come in SG, can tell the immigration that you have spoken to this officer before)

See what the ICA officer tells you. Normally if they don't allow, they will tell you a straight NO but your girl will not try her luck and will not be arrested too.

If it is a NO, then you try to go for appeals and work ur way 1 step at a time. No point think so far when we wouldn't know the conclusion. This solution is the best solution I can think for you rather than asking you and her to try your luck in trying to go past Immigrations with another identity. Its a very serious offence to do that and can be jailed.

But if you enquire now and declare for her, at most she cannot enter Singapore and no chance for her to be arrested and jailed. Either way you might lose, but you choose the one with lesser risks.

SC